[rfc-i] New Version Notification for draft-flanagan-plaintext-00.txt

Dearlove, Christopher (UK) chris.dearlove at baesystems.com
Tue Jun 24 06:17:24 PDT 2014

True with regard to that you need a tool to print the current text. But if I have such a tool, what it produces is well-defined.

" It depends on what HTML was generated, and how capable the viewer is." is precisely the worst sort of answer.

The advantage of PDF is it offers the possibility of a solution free of that ambiguity.

Christopher Dearlove
Senior Principal Engineer, Communications Group
Communications, Networks and Image Analysis Capability
BAE Systems Advanced Technology Centre
West Hanningfield Road, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, CM2 8HN, UK
Tel: +44 1245 242194 |  Fax: +44 1245 242124
chris.dearlove at baesystems.com | http://www.baesystems.com

BAE Systems (Operations) Limited
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-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Reschke [mailto:julian.reschke at gmx.de] 
Sent: 24 June 2014 14:12
To: Dearlove, Christopher (UK); Ted Lemon
Cc: Paul Kyzivat; rfc-interest at rfc-editor.org
Subject: Re: [rfc-i] New Version Notification for draft-flanagan-plaintext-00.txt

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On 2014-06-24 14:58, Dearlove, Christopher (UK) wrote:
> Some of us are not always free to choose our tools.

I just gave an example that works for me. Try a different browser if you want, and if that doesn't work for you then let's find out what needs to be fixed.

> And with regard to printing HTML suggestion, anything that requires a non-default setting to work is not a good plan. In fact relying on specific viewing tools is not good.

You make it sound as if the current plain text can properly printed without any specific tools.

> And how does it handle tables and figures? Keeps them together? Or arbitrarily splits them?

It depends on what HTML was generated, and how capable the viewer is.

> Clicking on links doesn't work on paper. And yes, paper still matters.
> Agreed, tables split with repeated headings may be right. But that's not the sort of splitting you'll get with freeform text. Do you get it with HTML?

Yes, when done right.

> To say "we've decided to seriously reduce the usefulness of text, but have no idea if there will be a format that satisfies a real need" really isn't good enough.

I didn't say that. I was talking about PDF because you asked.

I personally don't care a lot about PDF, because I'm very happy with the HTML variant.

> There should be a decision that there needs to be a format or formats 
> (doesn't even have to be the same in all cases)
> - Prints cleanly with a wide range of available tools.

HTML *does* print cleanly, when done right, and that's the intent.

> - Enables use of page numbers to go straight to a page.
> - Enables use of page numbers for reference.
> Nothing in Section 3.3 of RFC 6949 contradicts the first of these. I 
> think that it contradicts the other two, if considered as applying to 
> all formats, is bad. (I'm not suggesting all formats need to do these, 
> just one.)

The decision was made to give up on fixed pagination, thus page numbers will not be usable as unambiguous identifiers anymore. There will be ways to create paginated print outs with page numbers for those who are interested, but the page numbers will not be meaningful for the majority of readers.

Best regards, Julian

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